[00:00:00] Hi there, and welcome to this week's edition of the Whiteout Ski podcast. I am Dom Killinger from In the Snow magazine, and I'm joined from the Speciality Skier. I don't know what else I can say about you, Rob. 

It's Rob Stewart from Ski for

You know what I'll take, I'll take speciality skier. I could wear a badge saying speciality skier, couldn't I, when I go out and walk around town? I'd love to see what people ask me about if I wear a badge like that.

it's fresh

I mean, it's nearly winter, right? And it's really like the winter's just around the corner

makes me laugh how one day you're scrolling on Instagram and things are normal, and then the next day suddenly everything turns white. And it's like, "Oh, this is nice. Look, everything's turning white and it looks good." it's exciting, isn't it?

Yeah, I was flicking back, the other, this morning actually. Ellis Brigham's, history. So there's a really interesting history on their website. in the '80s they used to produce this magazine called The White Book.

right.

actually they still call it The White Book now. And I remember when I was a kid, going and trying to find that magazine somewhere in a shop in London. [00:01:00] I'd go to London just to get hold of a magazine, like, that had pictures of skiing in it, because that was the only place back then, apart from Ski Sunday, that you could see pictures of skiing and mountains, and get hold of a magazine like that at this time of the year.

mean you

now, of course, we're bombarded with it

not travel down to London to get hold of a copy of In the Snow magazine? Are you telling me you can't be bothered to do that anymore?

"In the Snow" was going in the 1980s, Dom, that would've been, that, I would've been going, I would've sat outside of the Ellis Brigham store for a week just to get the first copy of it.

for it to arrive

we've got a special edition of the YOW! Podcast. Everyone wants a chocolate box ski resort,don't they? you're talking so passionately there, and you think about

Hmm.

those sort of front of the Christmas card type stuff. We might well have the answer to that today

Yeah, and an answer that It's not a place that I know about. And so I'm really interested to hear more about it, because I have seen it. I've stood on top of a mountain and looked [00:02:00] down, at this village, and I've gone, "That looks amazing." But I've never been there

So is Pralognan-la-Vanoise France's most underrated ski resort? Well, today's special is in partnership with Peak Retreats, we're looking at what a ski week here is actually like. So first up, let's get the elephant in the room out the way. I need to say this resort like a French person.

am I saying this right, Pralognan-la-Vanoise? what do you think?

Well, we're joined by Olivier Lepereaux, a product development consultant at Peak Retreats. Olivier, you know this place really well. let's start by getting that pronunciation right. how will we say, the name?

we actually say Pralognan-la-Vanoise, but the locals call it Pralognan. won't find many people to call it the full name.

All right

is the correct spell... correct name

Perfect.

you were pretty close there, Dom.

did a good effort.

You were pretty close. And so hi, Olivier. Thanks for coming on to the, to the White Out podcast. I suppose [00:03:00] my first question really what was the first thing that made you think that this place, this place was just a bit different to other places?

Well, when you get there driving, you're driving to the far end of the valley, and the valley is a dead end. when you get to that point, the next step further is to go the mountains, which you can't your car. So you stop there. You've got this environment that brings a strong feeling to have traveled to somewhere special. and I also personally found that the smell of the smoking chimneys around the village was very authentic. was the sort of atmosphere that reminded me my childhood, in rural France. So somewhere I thought, "Okay, this is different."

Well, I guess, I mean, I guess that's a great place to start because anybody who's listening is gonna wanna know exactly where this place is. So it's in the Savoie region, isn't it? It's in the Tarentaise Valley. So an area familiar with British skiers. I mean, you've got Moûtiers, the train station, so it's probably [00:04:00] super handy to get there by train. And for those, who are driving, you've gotta think a- think along the lines of Courchevel, Méribel, La Plagne, Val Thorens, that kind of region. So everybody, listening is gonna know those resorts. So in terms of airports, I guess we're thinking Chambéry, we're probably talking G- Geneva. Are they the sensible places to come into?

Yes, there are. you can add, Lyon as

Okay, yeah

a, is a r- yeah, is a good, place to fly to. yeah, as you say, it's in the heart of the Tarentaise, so, you get all the easy access, from all means of transport

So interesting. I mean, we got, we got two experienced people here, Olivier. Why don't we know about this place?

Well, I am an experienced skier myself, and I live locally.

it's off the beaten track, I would say.

Yeah, right

That's what it's all about

Yeah, precisely. Yeah

I mean, just describe, maybe just get a feel of the village. you mentioned the smoke, but when, what would you notice, like, on that first morning, when you walk out of your, [00:05:00] accommodation, maybe walking to the ski lift or walking into the village?

Give us a bit of a flavor of that.

as you said before, the panorama, the surrounding mountains is the striking, vision you get first. And also it is a pocket village. It's not, far from, the various amenities to getting off, skiing because actually the piste right down to the heart of the village.

Right

So yeah, it's nice and compact. Are you, you're right in the actual Vanoise National Park, right?

Yeah, that's right. Yeah. And it-- you get access, to theski touring it-itineraries very easily. Ah, right

is the big, is the big thing in Pralognan

Okay. So a lot of ski touring possibilities to go into the Vanoise based in Pralognan itself. And I know, the Grande Casse is right there, isn't it? Famous mountain. It's a spectacular mountain with a big glacier coming off of it, right? So I mean, that must be quite a view

Absolutely. And when you get skiing there, you get to the point of, yeah, there's a, there's a sign that [00:06:00] says, "From here, you enter the Vanoise National Park," and, off you go.

Right

and it's quite something you want to try because it's just there. and you can hire a guide if you're not familiar with ski touring.

you go to your local ESF ski school, and, you... they can get you around, which is quite, yeah, well, quite an interest for a small resort like this

Yeah, right

wants that sort of chocolate box ski resort, don't they? I mean, we've been brought up with it, seeing almost views of this on the front of a Christmas card or in a magazine or whatever. I mean, it has that of localized feel. It's got a community, isn't it? I mean, what are there? 700, 800 permanent inhabitants.

So it just gives that different feel from a purpose-built resort, doesn't it?

Absolutely. I was amazed that, after skiing what we did, we went to the local bars, for a drink, and the place was full with locals, n- not tourists,

Ja

you could, you could feel that, you were into the village where, locals have got their, their habits, and then, they just live there. and y- you get merged into this local atmosphere like nowhere else I've been [00:07:00] recently in the Alps, to be honest

Yeah, I mean, who wants a purpose-built resort when you can have a genuine resort village that's got sort of height and acce-accessibility on its side? I mean, it's fantastic.

it is nice, to experience a proper village and the way that people live in the mountains sometimes, and go into a bar where, it is full of the locals. And, and hopefully a little bit of, a little bit of French goes a very long way, I would say.

A few bonjours and ordering a drink in French is a wise move, and then everyone's your friend for life. I find that in France. That's what I

Is

find.

Yeah.

is that your maximum stretch, Rob? Bonjour and that's it?

Well, I can do a little bit more than that, but I'm just saying that sometimes that's all you need. That's all you need

you know, e- even,being French I felt comfortable in this place thinking, "Okay, uh, you know, it looked very much like my childhood again," uh, as I w- I said before. Uh, places, you know, full of locals and, and you get friends, as you say [00:08:00] easily. It was charming, uh, even for myself, being, you know, French. so I can imagine, co- coming from the UK and, uh, getting that, that proper feeling of, uh, of being somewhere special.

Yeah, nice

Peak Retreats lists 26 kilometers of downhill piste. Is that enough for a British ski holiday? That's the key, isn't it?

Yeah, it's a good point. It's a really good point. I am a keen skier myself, and, I was pleased to, tick this box of being skiing to Pralognan. so I... not get-- y-you cannot get bored i-if you're a beginner or intermediate skier yourself or if you're traveling with s-children with-in their young age. there's a good selection of green and blues and red runs. They're well-equipped, they're well-maintained. and there's-- there are a couple of, very challenging black run. One of the black runs there is very challenging, and some people just travel to Pralognan just for testing that particular black run

Wow

the, off the main part of the ski re- ski area, [00:09:00] and then that takes you into this kind of a canyon. very, very interesting. But then for a week holiday, you will feel more comfortable being a beginner or intermediate skier because then, you can ski around across again the same piste and just, practice. as I said before, if you're a keen skier with... You can just try ski touring Pralognan is the place to be for ski touring.

Yeah, Olivier, I was l- having a look at the, the piste map, and it, it's an interesting area. It's got a pretty good vertical, like almost 1,000 meter vertical from the village up to the top. So that's a lot of terrain. And even though I could see, there's the 26 kilometers of marked ski runs, there's obviously some itinerary runs as well, maybe that black run that you're talking about that looked really interesting.

But,

you also mentioned the ski touring possibilities as well. So do you think that's something that for people that have got mixed ability groups, it's quite an interesting place to go? So somebody that might wanna just stick to the ski runs or maybe someone else wants to do something else

precisely.

[00:10:00] Yes.

I,

I think descending the same piste doesn't always mean to repeating the same run again and again. You actually practice and enjoy itself as you know what terrain you expect and

to play with,

And then you make progress, and you feel proud of yourself. On a

On a

bigger resort, sometimes you're tempted to adventure,

and further

you get tired, you struggle to get back, and you don't have-- you end not having a good day. So with mixed abilities in a group, it's much better for some people to stick to what they can do, and some other just

just

try something else. And Pralognan's got that to, vision of skiing, I would say.

and actually, the ski run goes all the way down to the village is what you said earlier. The village is around 1,400 meters, isn't it? So

I'm guessing that it's pretty snow sure all the way down as well, right?

would say that. Yeah. Pretty sure, yeah. Pretty, uh, snow sure.

Okay

de-

Yeah, definitely.

And is it, how busy does it get? if we're looking at, say, holiday times, peak holiday times, is it the kind of place where a lot of French families go over the, [00:11:00] over those,

peak holiday weeks? Or does it, is it a little bit more protected because of the location?

 

I would say it's protected.

beyond the fact that, the ski school holidays is, you know, it's getting busier.

Uh,

myself was skiing

skied

mid-March.

Okay

quiet enough. but of course it was off peak, off ski school holiday.

Right

like all-- like

resorts,

the,

the,

never get crowded basically. And the,

are invested in new, new, lift systems. So, I,

wouldn't say this is

a problem. The

Okay

not a problem there at Pralognan.

there in Pralognan.

Hmm. Right

I know that it's under the management, which probably doesn't mean a great deal to our listeners, but it's under the management of Compagnie des Alpes which, Rob and I obviously and yourself know. It-- Would you say this is a resort to watch for the future? Do you think they've got plans?

I th-- yeah, I, yeah, I think so. I think so. And this was, as I was there, this was, into the conversation obviously of why the resort, moved on to being, managed with Compagnie des [00:12:00] Alpes, a major player in the world for it. So I think they've got plans, absol-absolutely. They've got plans to make this a, even more, even more equipped resort than it is already.

So I think they are wise. Again, the locals may be locals, but they're wise people.

Yeah. And what else, what else can we do in Pralognan then? I mean, obviously we've talked about the downhill skiing, we've talked about ski touring. And, and I read on the Peak Retreats website that it's a pretty good Nordic skiing area as well. But what else is there to do?

I didn't practice Nordic skiing myself. the Pralognan was made, not I would say famous, but it was on the map of the 1992 Winter Olympics. they built the ice rink there,

ice rink now developed into a sports center. Yeah. I- I've got multiple sport activities for after skiing, like indoor climbing and,

like

and a spa as well.

[00:13:00] So,

I thought this, sports center was,

was a,

an adding for families possibly, for after skiing. Yeah, so

you mentioned the ice rink.

I think that was used in the 1992 Winter Olympic Games, wasn't it?

Yeah, it was. Yeah, it was built on purpose for it.

Right.

Yeah.

for the curling, I think as well,

For

is

Yeah.

So

And now I-

and you can have a try and get, and have a try for curling as well.

And that's, Oh, really?

interesting different access to, to, winter sports. Like-

Yeah

curling is a winter sport. and, yeah, that makes Pralognan, an... again, a different kind of,

flavor, I would say.

Yeah, right. It's pretty unusual to have an Olympic-sized ice rink in a, in a small village, I guess. And what about, if, let's say, I don't know, you wanna go out in the evening, a bit of a walk perhaps before dinner, maybe for a couple or maybe for a family.

what sort of thing can you expect in the town? Are there ... I g- I'm guessing there's restaurants 'cause it's a, it's a tourist destination, but what sort of stuff are we looking at?

Yeah. Yeah, [00:14:00] restaurants obviously, good restaurants, uh, uh, nice, you know, there's a nice, you know, central, area where,

every,

know, all elements are, are being,

know,

brought together. And so we have restaurants. not the place to go with, like, young adults, wanting, like

a

it's not a party resort.

It's not... No, it's not gonna have, like, live bands playing in the streets and things like that, right? It's not that kind of place. I think, I think, I think we realize that. I mean, I guess,

obviously

local Savoy- Savoyard,

food. Food.

I guess we're expecting that sort of,

Absolutely

those kind of restaurants, nice traditional,

I'm guessing there's sort of pizza places though as well, and things like that. You can cover off all those kind of things.

A-absolutely,

Yeah.

if you're, self-catering, there are nice, you know, small, you know, like mini markets and, and,

Right

small, cheese shops and, all what you expect in a, in a proper village like this.

Yeah.

Mm. Nice.

What about mountain restaurants? 'Cause we didn't cover that off.

I mean, I'm guessing that there's some [00:15:00] stuff on the mountain as well.

there because I-

Yeah

myself, uh, was usually done that, uh, product.

That sounds good

And this, and this was, this was spectacular. This was cheap.

and

the food, the place,

like this chalet

on the piste, what you would expect,

not a new one, like, an old-fashioned, nice, chalet you feel

but not a new one, like, an old-fashioned nice, chalet.

You feel, like, comfortable inside and outside

Mm.

and, and the food was excellent

Like a proper mountain refuge, but obviously they're doing food for lunch and you can stop. that's easily accessible, is it, from the, from the slope?

Right. You don't

Right

an expert. Yeah, it's-

it's there. yeah, absolutely.

and the sort of place where I, like you said, the prices, you're not gonna be like, it's not eye-wateringly

eye-watering

prices here, right? You're not talking, like

you're gonna walk into a place like that and think, "Oh my goodness," It's

pretty

normal pricing, I guess

Olivier, yeah, normal pricing.

It's absolutely- Yeah.

Right

it

in great food for, for, you

for- Good value. Let's say good value for money.

yeah,

Good value.

Absolutely.

So in

excellent

value

Olivier, [00:16:00] I mean, are we talking self-catered? Are we talking-- Is there any sort of hotels there? What, what's the feel?

With Peak Retreats, we feature two, self-catering residences. there's a choice of one that isright down in the village, and another one that is a bit little f-further off, but on, on the piste, so, easy access. And, where there's also, a nice, hotel that we feature as well.

there are more plans for the future for more self-catering residents in resort. So as we said before, this Pralognan will sort of slowly get on the map, for more, options for accommodation

And those are ski in, ski out, are they, did you say?

Yeah, there's one-- Yeah, there's one, one place at Pralognan. It's actually been developed into the building that is the gondola building. So it's

Wow

really the same building that's, of course, the residence and the gondola, So

That's the

life, spectacular scenery, a whole load of winter experiences right beneath Le [00:17:00] Grande Casse. I mean, the highest peak in the Savoie. Maybe I've answered my own question as to whether, like would I go there or who's gonna go there. I mean, it's, it sounds like it's obviously different.

It's not gonna be someone who's choosing between somewhere in Les Trois Vallées and here. This is a, this is a unique experience, isn't it?

Yeah, I would say anyone looking for a peaceful mountain experience. I- when I say mountain, I would say, beyond skiing. anyone looking for this must visit Pralognan. it has got something, really cool, with it. Like, you end up thinking, "Oh, does a place like that still exist?" Well, yes,

Mm. Yeah, right. Yeah, that's a really interesting point, it is a place that you feel. I'm already getting this feeling and I, I've s- I've seen the place with my own eyes kind of from a distance, but it does feel like that's that kind of place that time forgot,

and there's not a lot of that in, there's not a lot of that in the world that these days, is there? Let alone pretty much relatively on our, on our doorstep, as it were

I was visiting Pralognan when I stayed [00:18:00] in Pralognan. it was March,

It was sunny but chilly. And, I thought, probably the mountain environment or something, you really feel like you are the mountains. And

Mm.

there's

many places I've skied before where I've had this sort of

deep feel that, I was there, in the mountains.

Mm. I was,

that was quite cool

Yeah.

pleased. Mm. It's a special

Okay

I would just say something about, being a pocket ski area. you never... Y- y- you can't get lost on the ski, on the ski area. And sometimes people feel like it's safe for families when, you've got young kids and they get, more independent, and they want to get more independent.

And in a bigger resort, you would probably not, allow them to ski on their own. in Pralognan they can go on their own and just get back, you can't get lost, and that's q- q- quite a, an interesting view of a smaller ski

I, I think it's super important. Rob and I both have children of similar age, and you do reach that point [00:19:00] where they do wanna go on their own. But obviously if you're somewhere, a lot of resorts where they're, they could easily disappear and you're never gonna see them again. I think

Resorts like this are a really nice stepping stone to go to. even if you go there for sort of three, four, five days and allow them to go and ski off on their own, it gives them that experience of loading, unloading on a lift without anyone watching over them, skiing an area, let them make their own decisions.

Yeah, and the piste management, they have developed some- something that I thought was quite extraordinary. They have designed a kind of a off-piste, but, like, it's just, like, by the main, the main, slope, and it's, a, an itinerary in the forest that has been, organized, and very safe, but very fun as

உம்

for y- y- y- y- the, the sort of, middle age, middle, sort of, teenagers, and they want to have a feel of being, in the mount...

in, in the forest, skiing on their own, like, interesting terrain, go up and down, and it's all... It's been done very [00:20:00] nicely, and I

Mm.

at- attractive for families as

Hmm. Ja

That sounds cool. I saw also there's a snowboard cross track. Was-- Could also be a ski cross track, of course. It's, the same thing. And, and there's a slalom piste as well, so I guess there's a race club there, and there's all that sort of stuff going on like you would expect.

So yeah.

Well,

Hmm.

If Pralognan sounds like your kind of ski holiday, discover the, this destination with Peak Retreats. Pick the phone up They're specialists in French Alp ski holiday since 2002, and can arrange accommodation, travel, ski l- ski school, lift passes, ski hire, the whole shebang. Rob, I mean, it sounds like a place, doesn't it?

Yeah, definitely. Yeah, like Olivier said, this feeling of really being in the mountains, like properly being in the mountains in a very, or we'll say a, authentic village experience, and that's genuinely the case.

This is not, this is not a place that's designed, for, as a ski resort. It's a, it's a village in the heart of the mountains that has become a ski area. So yeah, very special.

that early sentence, Olivier, of you saying [00:21:00] that when you arrive and you can smell the smoke from the chimneys and that sort of thing, I think that just sort of really does evoke a

Mm.

sort of feeling. So thank you very much for joining us today and imparting your knowledge about a place where I think I'm gonna go and try out for a few days.

It sounds pretty cool

Thank

Thanks for joining us.

Thanks, Olivier

So Rob, there we go. The ultimate answer to the question, is everybody looking for that chocolate box ski resort? It's interesting, isn't it? That we're sort of obsessed with these huge ski areas and, of kilometers apiece. When you hear something like that authentic mountain life, those genuine communities living there, and those, the really nice sort of extra activities you can do, it's super cool, isn't it?

Yeah, I mean, it just proves there's something for everyone out there, right? there's... If you, if you want the big kind of resorts, then they're there. But if you, if you wanna try something a bit different, th- and this place, it just sounds, it's, it sounds lovely, doesn't it? It sounds really nice. it's a bit more peaceful.

it's really right in the middle of the Vanoise National [00:22:00] Park. It's a special place that not many people have, really, let's face it, not many British skiers have heard about it. I mean, I've heard of it but, kinda not ever been there. So yeah, really interesting. Really interesting

think for those people who want a taste of the sort of real mountain life, sort of rather than worrying about getting out at half seven in the morning, breakfast, get up the hill first thing, which we fully understand. that's, that is a certain type of skier. But for those sort of,

Yeah

couples or family skiers that are just looking for a bit of a retreat and a bit of a mountain destination, and a little less of the sort of hardcore skiing, but actually enjoying the mountain and the mountain life and engaging with the community, something that I feel like I could really get into.

it's my kind of thing. I have been to some of those sort of smaller resorts, those, yeah, those more sort of engaging smaller resorts, and it does really offer something quite special, doesn't it?

Yeah. It, it's very different. and I, I'm guessing, like, when you, when you go to a place like this, you are gonna be... I mean, I... the word [00:23:00] authentic is overused, isn't it? But it is, it is an authentic village. It is a proper village in the Alps, rather than sort of a ski resort first and foremost.

And I suppose that's one of the big differences between these sort of smaller places, And that's kind of the whole thing that you're getting is that little bit more of authentic, French experience

Yeah, exactly. Well, if you wanna find out more about visiting Pralognan-la-Vanoise, if I'm still saying it as well as I was at the start of this podcast, then, check out the podcast notes. Check out Peak Retreats. You can check them out on, Instagram of course, @peak_retreats, and obviously Facebook as well at Peak Retreats.

And, yeah, check out, Pralognan. what else can I say here? da. Yeah, check out Peak Retreats and look up Pralognan on their website, and obviously make contact with them. Talk to these people. They're sat in the office. They wanna talk about skiing. They're absolute specialists. They sit there all day waiting for your call to talk about these beautiful resorts. It's what you've gotta do, isn't it? You engage with real people again rather than just looking on a website

[00:24:00] Oh, absolutely. And that's what, that's what tour operators like Peak Retreats are great at, isn't it? There's someone on the end of the phone that you can actually call. And I'm telling you, I know, I, I know this company. I've, we've known them for years. The people that work there, they are passionate about skiing.

they are skiers. They go to these places. There'll be someone that's been to this place that you can actually speak to. and they're obviously they wanna sell you a ski holiday, but they go to lots of different destinations, and what they wanna do is make sure that they put you in a place where you're gonna love because you wanna go back there again, you wanna book another holiday with them.

So, it's in their interest to give you what it is that you, you're gonna get the most out of, right? And that's where a tour operator, I think, is completely invaluable. it's speaking to that person that's actually experienced that, that's actually been there, right? And we can do all the research in the world, and it's brilliant to do the research, and we all do research, online, of course, but there is still nothing like, and there never gonna be, you're never gonna be able to replace speaking to someone [00:25:00] that's been to a place and that tells you, "This is what you're gonna experience there, and this is why you should go there instead of that place," right?

Yeah, absolutely fair point. It's great just to talk to someone and understand, what the life and breath is of the, of the place, and how it feels when you're actually there. So, definitely go and check that out. Check out the podcast notes. All the link co- links are in there. Rob, until next week

Thanks, Tom.

Speak to

See you soon.

Bye

Cheers. Bye

Very good. Right, let's get

Okay.